LEILA FADEL, HOST:
I discussed President Trump's approach to the war on Iran earlier with the top Democrat on the House Armed Services Committee, Adam Smith of Washington state. And a note that we spoke just before confirmation that the U.S. military had launched strikes on Kharg Island.
Good morning, Congressman, and welcome back to the program.
ADAM SMITH: Good morning. Thanks for having me on.
FADEL: So we heard President Trump's threat to blow up every bridge and every power plant in Iran by tonight. He was asked if he was concerned that he would be committing war crimes under international law, given that this is civilian infrastructure. He said, quote, "not at all." What do you make of that answer?
SMITH: Yeah, I mean, it's really dangerous. First of all, I doubt seriously we have the capability to completely destroy Iran in four hours. We have a lot of bombing targets. We can hit a lot of different places, but it's a threat that really is not connected to reality. But then also, it is counterproductive to what we were supposed to be trying to accomplish here, which is to say we're against the Iranian regime. We are not against the Iranian people. You take an attack like that, you consolidate support for the regime by making this about the Iranian people. So, you know, it is just another disastrous step in what by any measure has been a disastrous war for the U.S. So, yeah, it's a very dangerous point right now. Further escalation would only up the cost of the war. It would not put us any closer to accomplishing any sort of strategic objective. Strategic objective being fundamentally changing Iranian behavior on their nuke program, their ballistic missiles and their support for terrorism.
FADEL: Well, President Trump was actually asked about the Iranian people, and he made the claim that the people of Iran are, quote, "willing to suffer" in exchange for freedom. Let's just listen to what he said.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: The Iranians have - and we've had numerous intercepts. Please keep bombing. Bombs that are dropping near their homes. Please keep bombing.
FADEL: Now he's threatening to obliterate the entire country. So who is best served by this approach?
SMITH: Oh gosh, I don't think anyone is best served by this approach. I mean, this approach just is going to make a lot more people suffer in the Middle East, globally. I mean, when you look at the impact that's been happening on oil, particularly in Asia, I mean, the president's right that the rest of the world is more dependent upon Middle East oil than we are, not that we're not. I mean, you see the price of gas is now up by well over a dollar from when this war started, which proves, among the many things, that Donald Trump doesn't understand. He doesn't understand how the global oil economy works and how it does impact us. But you've got countries throughout Asia that can't get access to gasoline. They're starting to have to ration it. It's having a devastating impact there. And certainly, you see in the Middle East, you know, the bombs keep flying back and forth. People are being killed in Lebanon. They're being killed in Israel. They're being killed in Iran, you know, so nobody that I can think of would benefit from an escalation of this war.
FADEL: Now, the president's also talking about these negotiations, indicating they're actually going well, even though Iran has rejected a proposed ceasefire deal. This carrot-and-stick approach to the negotiations, threatening to bomb everything while saying, actually, negotiations are going well, is this an effective approach to getting a deal and winding down this war?
SMITH: I can't imagine that it will be. I mean, who knows? I mean, as they say, the future is notoriously hard to predict. But the president's cluelessness on this is really, really problematic 'cause look at what has been reported about those negotiations. And this has not been as widely talked about as I think it should be. So we went into this war wanting to stop their ballistic missile program, their nuclear program and their support for terrorist organizations. And then, as a, you know, sort of another goal was a fundamental change to the regime. The Iranian people would rise up and the Islamic republic would end. The negotiations now have Iran saying what they want is they want a guarantee of no further attacks by Israel or the U.S. on Iran, Israel to end its attacks on Hezbollah. And then, if that happens, Iran says they will, quote, "open the strait" back up, but they'll charge $2 million a ship, split the money with Oman and use their money to rebuild Iran. They make no offer whatsoever on any of our priorities.
So we went into this war with those three problems I keep mentioning, and then the war caused an even bigger fourth problem, which is the shutting down of the Strait of Hormuz. So now we're fighting the war to open a strait that was open before we started the war. And the president talking about how, you know, we're close on the negotiations, what is he talking about? Nobody who's actually engaged in negotiations thinks that we're anywhere near close. So the president's threat to escalate is even more dangerous because it appears like he's going to have a choice. Either A, completely capitulate to Iran, put us in a worse position before we started, or B, cause massively more damage, as I outlined in - on your last question. So this war has gone from bad to worse at this point.
FADEL: I'm hearing this list of major concerns from you, concerns that a lot of Americans share. I mean, the majority of Americans, according to polling, do have major concerns about the prosecution of this war and whether this war should be happening at all, but they also have concern that Congress isn't doing anything, this other lever of government. Why isn't it doing anything?
SMITH: Two things. One, it is not doing anything 'cause the Republicans control Congress, and they're completely in the grip of Donald Trump. They will not do anything that he doesn't tell them to do, even as that is incredibly contradictory, as we've seen with the whole fiasco over paying TSA agents - had a deal on the table to do that. Trump, in a fit, said, no, don't. So they said, OK. Three days later, he changed his mind, and now they can't figure out how to get out of that. So that's number one.
Number two, look, as we have learned over a couple of hundred years of history, despite the Constitution saying Congress has the right to declare war, the Constitution didn't define war, OK? They gave the president commander-in-chief powers. The president has an enormous amount of power here. Congress could pass a law. Courts have been deferential, very deferential to presidential power when it comes to using the military. So the bottom line is we put an unstable narcissistic madman in charge of our country, OK? And we knew this. I mean, January 6 had already happened when he was, you know, elected again and put back into the White House. Trump has an enormous amount of power. And you hear from his press conferences. Is this a guy that you would trust with anything, much less the might of the United States military? I mean, his message on Easter that was completely unhinged. But that was hardly the only one.
FADEL: And you're referring to his online message that was - had the F-word in it and...
SMITH: Right.
FADEL: ...The mocking of Islam.
SMITH: Right, and basically celebrating the idea that he was going to get to kill a bunch more people in a couple of days if he chose to. Yeah, having someone like that in power is enormously dangerous. The only thing we need to keep - the Republicans in Congress have to stand up and at least speak out against this. We are headed down a disastrous path.
FADEL: Democratic Congressman Adam Smith of Washington state. Thank you very much for your time and your insights.
SMITH: Thank you.
(SOUNDBITE OF SLOWMO FRIENDS' "PLANTS FOR FREE") Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.
