SCOTT SIMON, HOST:
President Trump says Iran must stop choking traffic through the Strait of Hormuz or the U.S. will, quote, "finish it off one way or the other."
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: We're going to open up the Gulf with them - with or without them. But that'll be open.
SIMON: And to that end, there's news of two American warships transiting the strait today. That's as Vice President JD Vance meets face to face with negotiators in Pakistan. We've got NPR White House correspondent Franco Ordoñez joining us now. Franco, thanks so much for being with us.
FRANCO ORDOÑEZ, BYLINE: Thanks for having me, Scott.
SIMON: Let's please begin with the warships. What do we know, and what do we know about today's talks?
ORDOÑEZ: Yeah. As kind of you mentioned, two U.S. Navy guided-missile destroyers passed through the Strait of Hormuz today. Now, this would mark the first transit of American warships since the start of the war, you know, which began 6 weeks ago. The U.S. says this is the start of a process of reopening the strait to commercial shipping. And again, as you noted, it comes as American and Iranian teams are meeting in Pakistan for peace talks led by the vice president, Vance. You know, they kicked off this morning between the U.S., Iran and Pakistan, which of course is serving as host and intermediary for the talks.
SIMON: To state the obvious, I suppose, this seems like a huge test for Vice President Vance.
ORDOÑEZ: Yeah, very much so. I mean, perhaps the most significant of his political career. I mean, it'll be a defining factor as he looks ahead to a, you know, possible run for the White House himself. I mean, really, so far Vance has been behind the scenes on Iran, ceding the spotlight to Trump and other officials, including the defense secretary, Pete Hegseth and Secretary of State Marco Rubio. You know, Vance now has a lane here, and it's a very important one, trying to end this conflict. You know, it's also a strategic move by the administration. Vance is known as the member of the Cabinet who is most opposed to the war, so choosing him for these talks, at least according to foreign policy experts, is a sign, possibly, to the Iranians that Trump is serious about peace.
SIMON: And let's talk about the challenges obviously that abound. What's the status of the ceasefire?
ORDOÑEZ: Yeah, I mean these talks really couldn't come at a more delicate time. I mean, it's really on shaky ground. Trump was even complaining yesterday about Iran keeping the strait closed and trying to charge tolls. I was talking with Matthew Kroenig, who had the Iran portfolio at the Pentagon. He said the stakes are super high and that success will likely depend on the issues discussed. He said they might succeed if they keep the negotiations focused on the strait, but he said if talks include a longer list of issues, such as missiles and uranium enrichment, that could be much harder to get a deal. And, of course, those are the issues that Trump started the war over.
SIMON: If diplomacy is not successful, the Trump administration is likely to go back to a large-scale bombing campaign against Iran. So I think the stakes are literally war and peace.
SIMON: And, of course, a huge concern of the Trump administration is the Strait of Hormuz. Certainly seems to be critical to the ceasefire, and it remains effectively closed. Would that be a reasonably accurate assessment?
ORDOÑEZ: I mean, I will say that the strait is obviously what this war is all about now. I mean, it's the source of leverage for Iran, Iran that the U.S. has, and, you know, people around the world didn't realize Iran had. I mean, I was talking with Kroenig, and he says Iran probably didn't realize that they had all this power either.
MATTHEW KROENIG: Essentially, what Iran is engaged in is state-sponsored piracy. It's using the threat of force to hold hostage international trade. This is something that the United States and its allies have worked to eradicate over the past 80 years, and so the last thing that we would want is to end this conflict with Iran in control of the strait.
ORDOÑEZ: Now, Trump says that's not going to happen, and he added that it might not be easy, but he expects the strait to open soon, and I think we're seeing that today.
SIMON: I remember the Carter administration. I was a young reporter. Direct talks with Iran don't happen very often, do they?
ORDOÑEZ: Yeah. I mean, these will be the highest-level talks between the U.S. and Iran in decades, I mean, the closest since the Revolution was in 2013, when President Obama had a phone call with the Iranian president. But these stakes are higher. They will likely determine whether the cease holds or the fighting begins again.
SIMON: NPR White House correspondent Franco Ordoñez. Franco, thanks so much.
ORDOÑEZ: Thank you, Scott. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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